Hello, dear listener, and welcome back to the 2nd Great and
Bountiful Human Empire, the only Doctor Who flashcast that's
decided that tomorrow is definitely going to be shoulder day.
I'm Nathan.
I'm Brendan.
I'm James and I'm Todd.
Well, we're here to talk about series 2, episode one.
I think it's season two, episode one, isn't it?
Is that the right way you're talking about it?
nomenclature?
Yes, yes.
And it's the Robot Revolution by Russell T. Davis as usual, and
directed by Peter Hore, who we will see later this season, but we
already know him from a good man goes to war, and it's a sin, it
turns out.
So this is an exciting new episode.
The beginning of a new companion's tenure on board the TARDIS.
So there's a lot to talk about, but let's just start by talking
generally about how we felt about the episode.
Todd, do you want to start us off?
Was a much better opener than last year.
Polish.
I would give it at least a seven.
Polish.
I can't keep doing this for much longer.
Manny.
Now, I'm someone who didn't think that Space Babies was the crime
against humanity that some of our associates thought it was, but I
thought this was sort of up there with it. definitely enjoyed
myself.
What did you think, Brendan?
Um, on 1st viewing.
I was left kind of confused by it, but I rewatched it today and
enjoyed it a great deal more.
I think it probably is a better opener than space babies, but I am
also someone who quite enjoyed space babies.
And finally, how about you, James?
Well, unlike Todd, I could stand to do many much longer.
I know that's not what you meant, Todd.
But no, I really enjoyed it.
I really enjoyed it.
And like Brendan, I quite enjoyed Space Babies as well.
I thought this was much stronger.
It was just a good solid story with some really interesting
concepts behind it and it was just, yeah, it was a lot of fun and
made social commentary.
It's kind of funny, isn't it?
Because when you're comparing it to like previous Russell T. Davies
season openers.
They're all like, you know, nearly 20 years old.
And so it's kind of impossible, I think, to kind of cast your mind
back and think how you felt.
And, you know, just the kind of level of emotion that I have about
literally all 4 of those.
You know, I have to remember, I'm not going to feel that about
this.
And I didn't feel that about space babies.
And so it's a little bit kind of hard to judge, but I thought it
was really fun and just looked amazingly gray and was very
different from any of those openers, which I'm definitely up for.
So the most important new element that the show has this season is
Varada Sithu, who is playing Belinda Chandra.
We met her in Boom last year and she is a very different companion
I think, from what we've had before.
I know we always say that, but this kind of definitely seems like
that.
What did you make of her, Todd?
She was wonderful.
She out-acted shooting.
She acted him off the screen.
She left him in the dust as far as I'm concerned.
She is Romana one.
Maybe she is from mano one.
But then again, I think this story is a mix of Flash Gordon and
mixed with the Armageddon factor.
But good, you mean?
Yes, I've already said that.
Actually, Richard wanted us to mention like John Carter of Mars
and stuff, you know, those Edgar Rice Burrows things.
And even kind of like the last Starfighter, it's got that sort of
feel to it, you know, someone from Earth for some reason, he's
revered by an alien civilisation who to kind of get them so that
they can take their rightful place as queen or champion or
whatever.
So there is that and that is something that we've never had
before.
And we haven't had a reluctant companion, I think, am I right?
Have we had a reluctant companion in the new series?
Oh, Donna, for our 1st story.
Yeah, yeah, but after that, she seeks him out, doesn't she?
And she brings luggage. you know she's definitely there.
Yeah, I think I think the closest we've had is Martha, uh, in the
Santara and um, the doctor's daughter, where, you know, she's not
meant to be going in the Tartars.
That's not a full-time thing.
And previously, she did want to be there full-time.
Yeah, yeah.
And I think it's a great touch.
I'm surprised we haven't had one of those for years or the idea
that we can't get back.
You know, that's something we've often said, oh, Peter Capaldi
can't control the Tartars in his 1st scene, we're not going to get
back.
Oh, no, wait, we're back.
Jodie Whittaker loses the Tardis in her 1st seat.
Oh, wait, no, we're back.
Yeah.
So it's nice that they're finally doing it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's, um, it's, it's, it's a thing that they do too, where they
they don't fall into some of the pitfalls that previous reluctant
companions, you know, because if you've got a reluctant companion
the audience is not in sympathy with them, unless they kind of
hate watching the show, I guess, we all want to be with the doctor
to who fans?
Well, yeah, no, that's fair.
We all want to be with a doctor, and so we think that Tegan is
crazy for not wanting to travel with him.
And it really goes out of its way, I think, to show that it's not
that she's unadventurous.
It's not that she uh, is small-minded or anything like that and
they go, they do such a good job of presenting how warm and and
you know, smart and and caring she is.
Humane.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
And it's part of her makeup is part of her job, but she is
actually also a really caring person who loves being a nurse.
Yeah, because she's making a difference in the world.
Yeah, I mean, that opening scene with her in the hospital is a bit
similar, I think, to Martha's very 1st scene, maybe not quite as
funny, but just, you know, that it is just a series of little
scenes that show what she's like as a person.
And she's not reluctant to travel with a doctor.
She's just seen the doctor's previous companion die.
And so, you know, and she is wary of him.
And I think that that's pretty, you know, interesting.
You know, she this is all still kind of part of the kidnap in a
way.
And so I'm really sympathetic to that.
I think that that's going to be an interesting dynamic.
And also she calls him out on that thing.
He always does to people where he scans them without permission
and she calls him out for not asking for consent for testing her
DNA, which is definitely handled as well.
I like what you said there, that she's wary of him.
And I think that's a good thing.
Yeah.
And she so she's not in awe of him.
You know, she doesn't and and that's a really good contrast with
with Milly, isn't it?
Because she's much younger than shooty as an actor and, you know
much younger than the doctor appears as a character.
Belinda's got to be in her sort of early to mid 30s.
And the actor is.
But, you know, she had a boyfriend 17 years ago, a horrible, odious
boyfriend 17 years ago.
Um, then, you know, she's definitely older and so she's not in awe
of him.
She doesn't want him to fight her battles and she is the one who
stands up and resolves the plot.
Hmm, she's also a sci-fi nerd because she gets the plot device.
She goes, oh, you know, like she works out the Belenovic
limitation effect.
And basically, you know, signposts towards how she is going to
resolve the plot.
Um, so she has seen Modred undead.
You see, this is the thing, right?
She goes, oh, I've seen movies.
And I sat there thinking, I can't readily think of any sci-fi
movies that have something similar to the Blinovic limitation
effect because, you know, time travel movies are a subgenre within
sci-fi.
So there's less of them than there is, say, alien or Star Trek or
Star Wars.
Uh, but it's just like, yeah, yeah.
She's seen the modern undead equivalent episode of Professor X
That's what it is.
Or the omnibus edition of Morden Undead, all edited together as a
movie.
Yeah, it could definitely be it.
I would like to say, though, about Belinda.
If I had a dollar for every time Russell T. Davies had a blonde
companion, uh, with whom the doctor had facilitated the meeting of
an absent parent, uh, who then leads to be with her family, then
replaced by a companion who is a woman of colour, who works in a
hospital.
But I'd only have $2, which isn't much, but it's weird that you've
done it twice, RTD.
Yeah.
It's funny that we just get a mention of her parents.
And in fact, what I thought was interesting is that she is a
professional who is in her early 30s, but she can't afford a house
and so she's living in horrible share accommodation, with 2 people
who don't even really know what her name is, like, and that's kind
of miserable, and it's a little bit of a kind of the moffetization
of RTD too.
There's a lot of Moffat in this story.
And I think having 2 companions in a row who are mystery, you know
another companion who, you know, the doctors travelled through her
time stream instead of the other way around.
Um, uh, the big thing happening on the date of broadcast of the
final episode of the series like we had in season five.
Oh, I think it's actually on the on the date of the 2nd last
episode.
That's possible too.
Yeah.
But all of that is kind of fun and I'll be interested to see where
that goes.
Let's talk about the, um, the setting, which is the planet Miss
Belinda Chandra one, uh, with the, what are they, the Miss Belinda
Chandra kind?
My favourite thing is where the robots are dropping Miss Belinda
Chandra bombs.
I think it's just that's so dark.
That's so brutal.
It's very Douglas Adams as well.
Yeah, this whole thing reminded me of um, those scenes in, Is it
um so long and thanks for all the fish?
Or is it mostly harmless?
Um, where, where the droids are attacking the hitchhiker's offices
and they keep sending like upgraded versions of the same robot to
attack it.
And Ford keeps running rings around them because he's cleverer
than they are.
It really, it felt like that.
It was just not a bad thing.
No, no, no.
And, you know, Moffat has been someone who's who's heavily drawn
on Douglas Adams.
And just having that very idea where you have, you know, those
stupid things where you can buy someone a star and just having the
star find out about it and coming to get you.
Like, that's genius.
That's absolutely brilliant.
So apparently Russell thought of that, um, many years ago, and put
it in his box of ideas, I might bring out one day and then he had
the chance to do it for the season open, and it makes her, it
makes a fun, um, easy, easy entry and into the series and shows
her what the show can do in that setting.
What did you think of the setting, Tom?
I really enjoyed it.
Like, as I said, I felt it had a Flash Gordon type of feel.
That cue, that green hue in the control room with the sort of reds
in the background, and then the green in the underground, um, and
and it was her tending to the injured in the underground, while
the bombardment happens, that sort of reminded me of the
Armageddon factor, when the princess is down there tending to the
people, you know, who were, who were injured, and, and I kind of
thought, 0 my god, there's like, there's a romance at the
beginning, the princess and the queen is sort of connected to
time.
There could be the black and white guardian involved.
You know, there's there's a robot AI controlling the wall, but
actually there's a man, you know, a mask behind that, you know, and
another robot comes to save the day, and there's, and then
somewhere else there's something between 2 plants we can't get to
and and then Manny has a big gun, and Drax has a big gun, and I
just thought, well, it's, it's the Armageddon.
Is the Armageddon factor.
It is the Armageddon.
But, you know, there were things that I just kind of drew on that
you know, was, but I really, I love the robots.
I like them being like a mix between smile and dinosaurs on a
spaceship and, you know, the husbands of River song robots and and
little polish polish and, and, um, yeah, I just, I just really
enjoyed all of that.
And the music, the music was quite, I thought epic.
It reminded me of Star Wars or something.
I really felt like this was an epic adventure that had been edited
down because we didn't get to see to doctors, you know, 6 months
on the planet or really how they got back to the AI, you know?
Yeah.
I mean, I just thought, you know, that sort of retrofuturist kind
of look, you know, where everything kind of looks like a 1950s
American car, particularly the little polish polish robot.
Um, and like when the the rocket ship, you know, like when the
spaceship that lands in her back garden is just a massive rocket
ship with huge curved fins and stuff.
That's fantastic, you know.
That's Splash Gordon.
And that, I thought it was meat the beans.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, definitely we've had some of those design elements in, you
know, perhaps the other straightforward science fiction story of
this entire era, which is the Starbeast.
Yeah, yeah, I just thought, I thought that that was really great.
And I thought what was really good about it too was that it was
comic.
You know, there's that moment where Belinda says, why is
everything on this planet so stupid?
It's comic, but, you know, people die.
Like the doctor suffers a loss.
You know, people are scared.
Um, you know, like it's it's a proper thing.
The government are bombing populated areas, like all of that sort
of thing is happening.
And so it is properly dark, but there's that just sort of fun
Toyota kind of veneer to it.
What did you think, Brendan?
Yeah, I thought the setting was beautifully realised.
It does have all those Flash Gordon, John Carter, Egarice Burrows
and the interpretations of those kind of texts.
The rocket ship also reminded me of Tin tins rocket ship, but in
yellow rather than red.
And on story linkages.
I had not seen the connections to Armageddon Factor, and I love
that because I have a huge soft spot for the Armageddon Factor.
But listeners may remember that last series I made connections
between last year's run and the original season one of Doctor
Who.
And I didn't think I had much to connect this to Planet of Giants
except, of course, the TARDIS not working and the doctor opening
the doors in space has happens at the end.
We have miniaturisation because Alan goes microscopic.
And I'm really sorry to fling a dead cat on the table. they both
have a dead cat.
You couldn't really fling that dead cat on the table.
It did get disintegrated on the doormat.
Those disintegration effects are very comic book.
Like I just felt that they were like just the sort of the outline
and all that, that thing.
And, you know, I'm a statistic person and I was mortified by the
dead cat, but also quite sort of thrilled that the master killed a
dog.
So, you know, here we go, dead cat. whatever.
It's actually perfectly handled, I think, the joke, the joke with
that of you, you shot the cat.
The cat is irrelevant.
It wasn't my cat.
The cat is still irrelevant.
I think that we're going back to the era of the original the
original RTD era where each alien had a particular way of killing
people and a particular special effect that went with it.
And you remember the sicker acts where they have those whips that
turn people into sort of skeletons and stuff.
And here, like, it's a science fiction thing, so you don't have
dead bodies or gore or anything like that.
It is comic book, but it's also a little bit graphic because you
get skeletons, you know.
And so...
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And we get slow motion, obviously, on Sasha 55's death. as well to
make it a bit more harrowing.
I thought that death was so well handled too, because you finally
got a doctor who, you know, expresses that grief, and then shakes
it off and moves on, you know, but properly expresses it.
It's not just, I'm sorry, and we quickly get on with it.
He feels it and then gets on with it.
I thought that was pretty good.
I'm going to disagree.
That for me was a point in the episode where she said that she
wanted to go, you know, into space or trusted him with the life
and I thought, oh, God, you're dead in 2 minutes.
That's right.
And then and then I just waited for, oh, let's give me give me the
single tear. and he gave me the single tear and I just said going
I'm over you crying.
I would have preferred that tear at the end, perhaps, you know
when they talked about what they were naming the citadel, but that
was almost the low point in this episode for me.
No, that landed for me, I think, because it, you know, it made
something that shooty does quite a lot actually kind of mean
something more than perhaps it normally does.
And it needed to sell that, I think, because we didn't get to see
them interact, really.
That was my problem, was that we didn't get the 6 months and then
building a relationship and I just kind of went, why, whatever.
Yeah, I mean, I actually, I, I, I think we're carrying on front
top, but I agree with Nathan.
Like that has weight because it's about somebody that we don't
know.
It sells the fact that they were friends that had worked together
for 6 months because you don't have time to show that.
Whereas, yes, quite often he just does start crying.
Like, oh, Ruby, I love you.
I've known you for 3 episodes but it's fine.
Like, I don't have a problem with them crying, but often I think
it's just, you know, let's, he's great at crying.
Let's wheel out his tear ducts.
We call it the Sanequa Martin Green effect.
Because I actually felt something at the end when they called the
citadel after her and I actually got an emotion there and I
thought, well, you've actually, you've sold that to me, like it
has affected me.
She's really good in that one scene with Belinda too, isn't she?
Oh, yeah, she's very good.
See, I think how it might have worked better for me is to not have
that line of, you know, then you promise to take me to the stars
because as you say, Todd, that tells us that she's dead in 2
minutes.
Well, that's where I was there, though, isn't it?
But then you're not shocked, right?
You can see they've been close.
The doctor's been giving her nods and whatnot.
And then if you get the doctor's reaction, you suddenly go, why
hasn't it reacted that way to anyone else?
And then he tells Belinda about them in the bunker.
But then I also have to remember that this is not just being
written for adults.
This is being written for 12 year olds, who may not immediately
guess that she's, you know, that she's going to be dead in a
minute.
And that's that's always the difficulty with Doctor Who, isn't
it?
That it has to write to all levels.
So we who've been watching it for 35 plus years go, that's the
trope.
We know that's the throne.
Yes, but you don't want to spoil it for the 12 year old.
We had to be given the opportunity to learn that that's what that
means.
And a whole generation of kids get it.
Thank you, Brendan, for reminding me like I'm an old my god, that
which doesn't think of small children at these times.
Yes.
We, we, um, we killed Matthew Waterhouse, so, uh, so you could
run.
All right, well, let's move on.
We should talk about Al, the generative owl, or whatever he is.
How did we think that confrontation and that character worked?
Todd.
Why are you asking me?
I thought it did work well and it tied obviously everything into
the whole time. plot.
Um, and I thought the look of him was actually quite creepy
really.
And it tied it, like I said, it tied it all back into the
beginning scene and what he actually was like as a boyfriend, which
wasn't very good, really.
So I bought it.
And, you know, obviously when they revealed the AI and they took
down the thing and it set out, I thought, okay, he did it in plain
sight.
Al bought it too.
Um, It does a similar thing in a more subtle and singular way that
Dotson bubble did last year, which is you can already see that
he's a bit of a misogynist in his very 1st scene.
There's lines in there about girls are not great at maths.
You know, are you married, which, you know, the whole thing hinges
on.
And then they have flashbacks which just really sort of drive that
home when, when she sort of says, oh, yeah, no, you, you were a
terrible controlling bust, basically.
And, and, and so I, I really enjoyed that.
Like, he was kind of mixing the Doctor Who doing social commentary
as allegory with Doctor Who doing social commentary as social
commentary.
Like, he was, he was controlling.
And now he's doing it to an entire planet.
He's been responsible for the deaths of, you know, 1000000s of
people.
Yeah, what was it?
What's the line?
You took coercive control and took control of the entire planet?
Something like that?
Yeah, I mean, I think it's impossible to see sort of populated
areas being bombed and think about the kind of people who
generally support that.
And, you know, you end up thinking there is a line between sort of
misogyny and, and, you know, perhaps in some of its aspects, gaming
and computer stuff and politics, and, you know, none of those
things are really drawn or fleshed out, but it's not really the
focus of the episode, but it's certainly, it's striking, I think
that we take, like, something that looks like just awkward and
horrific kind of teenage dating. and then draw a line from that to
kind of carpet bombing populated areas.
Planet of the in cells, I guess, is what she says.
Yes, yeah.
This was actually the scene that I...
Kind of didn't like the 1st time around and it's got nothing to do
with the content.
It was actually to do with the direction.
And I'm just like, So why is Alan just kind of sitting there while
the polishing robot comes up with the thing that can destroy him.
Uh, why is that happening?
But then, watching it the 2nd time, help me save me pain.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
There, there, every ninth word, he knows what is happening to him
and it is there.
And I think it's left ambiguous and I think it's deliberate that
part of him wants this to end.
Part of him knows what he's done.
You know, and he's he's had 10 years to reflect on his behaviour.
And so there's an ambiguous possibility there that he knows this
could kill him, but it will end what's happening.
And I like Russell doing that sort of ambiguity.
It's a bit like the ambiguity of Margaret Slovine back in Boomtown
when she looks into the heart of a TARDIS and looks up and says
thank you.
Does she realise she's being given a 2nd chance?
You know?
Um, I wouldn't exactly say, you know, the character doesn't
deserve redemption, but there's a reading of potential redemption
there while also acknowledging this guy's been a bastard and a
dictator and needs to be stopped.
He's given a 2nd chance.
He becomes an egg and a sperm, like in a similar way. and then
gets vacuumed up.
It's kind of, it's both giving him release, but also inaugulation
can get away with it.
Yeah.
And the, the sort of Blinovich limitation, inferno dimension warp
business that goes on.
It's fantastic.
It is, it is.
It is.
You know, it's it's indistinct.
We don't know exactly what's happening.
We don't know how it feels for them to go through it. really like
that bit.
The doctor's reaction was also something I had a bit of a problem
with.
It's like, okay, so the doctor watches Helen A, for instance, cry
over the dead Fifi, and is moved and doesn't gloat.
The doctor sees a sperm and an egg, gets sucked up by a vacuum
cleaner, and does a high kick and a little dance, and I'm just
like, uh, but then, this doctor is starting to display signs of
arrogance and that he knows best, and it's like, okay, taken as a
whole, he can also shut down a power in a whole hospital.
Good luck if you're on life support, kids.
They have generators.
It fine.
Yeah, yeah.
I know, I know.
But that's the thing.
I'm glad I watched it a 2nd time to kind of take the take the
piece as a whole because sometimes that can be hard to do when
you're watching it for the 1st time.
All right, let's just go around the table and talk about how we
found the end of the episode.
A lot of chatting the TARDIS and then off to new adventures.
I have to say that I'm a little bit anxious about how much there
now is to resolve. and I wasn't someone, again, who thought that
the finale last year did a bad job of resolving what it needed to
resolve, and I was sort of fairly happy with how things came out
but there's just a lot of balls in the air at this and it did
there was a lot of talking in the TARDIS, in a kind of series 6
kind of way. and I just was kind of wondering how that will go.
But I am excited to see what's coming up, I have to say.
Todd, how are you feeling at this point of the season?
Well, Nathan, I, um, wasn't exactly thrilled with the resolution
of last year, unlike you, and I do feel that often, Russell
struggles to resolve things in a satisfactory way, and I am
concerned about so many questions that need answering.
But I'm intrigued and I'm on for the ride.
So, you know, he's doing something right.
And, you know, even if they don't resolve what's happening, you
know, with Earth and not getting back.
As long as I find out who Mrs. Flood is, that's all that matters.
You never saw me.
So cute.
Brandon, what do you think?
So I'm thinking about the fact that the 1st scene was 17 years
ago.
I am thinking about the fact that Matt puts it in 2008.
I am thinking about the fact that Ruby Sunday would have been 4
around that time.
And that's the thing.
I'm wondering if there is some connection between Ruby and Belinda
that we're just not aware of yet.
And I have some ideas on that, but I'm going to keep my power dry
because if I, if I'm right, I don't want to spoil, I don't want to
spoil things for anyone.
Well, so far, the only connection I can see is they have the same
next door neighbour.
Yes, yeah.
They're living in the same street.
I'd really like, given that it's an episode set in 2007 later in
the season.
The person who inspired Belinda to become a nurse, to be Moth
Jones, a young, a young doctor.
Yes.
Not the joke.
Well, you know, like, I mean, you wouldn't really need to, like
Freeman is still gorgeous.
But yeah, that's my 2 cents with.
Bring back Martha Jones.
Well, all right.
I think we might wind up there.
We're obviously going to be back next week and every week for the
next 7 weeks.
In fact, to follow season 2 to its conclusion.
But I've got one or 2 things to plug.
Um, 500-year diary series 2, uh, the 2nd series, which is called
the 2nd coming, arrives on the 27th of April with our episode on
the Dalek invasion of Earth.
And we're going to be looking at the 2nd time a Montreal villain
appears in Doctor Who.
You can keep up with us on flightthroughentirety.com on Blue Sky
or on FTE podcast on Mastodon, or I think we're still on Twitter
probably.
And of course, I'm watching Star Trek more or less weekly with my
friend Joe Ford in Untitled Star Trek project.
Brendan, do you want to plug something?
The most recent episode of the three-handed game is appropriately
enough on the episode game.
Meanwhile, over on maximum power.
We are far ahead of games, so it can't hurt you anymore, Nathan.
But we have we have recently published our series D retrospective
which is almost 3 hours long and nearly killed me.
Yes, well done, Brendan.
Well done.
Excellent work.
All right.
In that case, all the remains is for me to say, until next time
remember that Miss Belle Chandra is an anagram of Chambers
Island.
You heard it here first.
Thank you very much for listening and good night.
Good night.
Ta-ta.
See you soon.
And could I just ask?
Could he really not see the Eiffel Tower coming towards the
Tartars?
It wasn't that far away.